If the whole is equal to the sum of its parts than our "whole" cannot be reached until our parts are gathered and acknowledged. This blog will act as a collection, a gallery that records our “parts and particles” (our particulars) in an effort to connect the dots; to endlessly connect the dots.
Everyone is trying to dignify what these criminals have done. The truth of the matter is, if you've done something wrong there are conseqences to be paid. If you take someones life you have time to pay off for that.
ReplyDeleteMaking excuses for them is wrong. Yes, they are still people, but that doesn't mean they should be excused from anything because of that. If they comited a crim so inhuman as taking someone else's life, then why should they be treated like one?
I am in between on this subject. I feel enviroment, media, family, and peers all play into how a person turns out. They all affected me, but im trying to break away from it. So i think my opinion is that you can come out of certain situations. But like Kris said today, if those kids had death in their lives they are usually not afraid of it. So if these boys were surrounded by certain things it forms a certain character in a person. I honestly don't think that EVERYONE has the ability to change, but thats just me. So technically, because they committed the crimes, they are at fault, but only because they were conditioned at a young age.
ReplyDeleteI feel that they are responsible for making the things they have made. However being a product of their enviroment makes them become wh othey are, but does not control what they do. Everyone has the choice to do what they want.
ReplyDeleteI don't know too much about true notebooks. but based on what you said about product of environment or it being strictly their fault.
ReplyDeleteI think that environment has a big part of things, and people can become something they wouldn't have become because where they live.
But there comes a point where one has to take responsibilities for their actions. there is a thing called personal responsibility. We are held accountable for our actions. I sympothize for the boys but do not feel they are being wronged. the law is the law and the penalty is the penalty. thats that.
my friend is facing jail time and honestly i felt like he knew what he did was wrong before he did it but i also feel he just felt it was necessary(spelled by dom)
ReplyDeleteIf you guys aren't reading True Notebooks, go ahead and try to apply this question to Persepolis. What can be brought in from that text?
ReplyDeleteI cant say whether or not they were a product of their environment or if its just their fault because I don't know the full extent of the crimes they committed and the who, what, when, where and why of the situation
ReplyDeleteI feel like there is a reason for everything… they mite have been part of the environment but they mite have just did it to do it… we do have crazy ppl in the world that does things for the satisfactory of it… but we were never given what happen between them and the murders in full detail we just know they are in the unit for murderers in the juvenile center
ReplyDeleteI think that they maybe a product of their environment.. but I think that they also make their own decisions. The kids in true notebooks could have easily been like no I don’t want to do that.. but then again I have never been around it to understand it…but in my mind I don’t think that environment had an effect on them.
ReplyDeleteI think that when growing up in the environment that is bad you just have to have a good head on your shoulders… I personally think if people get involved with gangs are weak.. why? Because they aren’t strong enough to say that they don’t want to be involved.. But then again I am not from a place where there is lots of gangs so I don’t know.
product of environment is something we say a lot in this class i was hoping someone could elaborate on exactly clasifies someone as that
ReplyDeleteI think for some, they are a product of their environment. I assume they don't have good family background and help in making good choices. Also peer presure can play a part in their decision. Some feel its a way to make a quick buck, others feel that being in jail isn't all that bad.
ReplyDeleteResponding to Kyrin, I believe product in their enviorment" is they comitted the crimes because of where they live, or how they were raised, or the people they were surrounded with.
ReplyDeleteThis is mainly used as an excuse.
Alot of these criminals go off of:
ReplyDelete"When you've got nothing, you've got nothing to lose"
which puts them in a place where they just don't care.
I agree with mike - "This is mainly used as an excuse"
ReplyDeleteI'm not reading True Notebooks, but society or the self? It's hard to say because they're codependent, if you're nurtured to your immediate social world are your decisions blurred or is it a complete channel of environment? It my opinion it stands in the middle, technically making it their fault. Mental independence is one of our most prized luxeries and all inclusive, but because of its openess it can easily be changed to knew processes or concepts, and in this case become corrupted. But this still gives you personal voice, and the option to stay out of negative and dangerous influence. Yes, their response was a tought one and definitely a product of their environment, but no matter what there's more than one option. This is fersure in a grey area though
ReplyDeleteGoing with what Clarence said about them feeling that jail isn't that bad, some of them might not have actually committed the crime but took the blame for it so they could be in jail because it may be better than being on the outside. Jail could be looked at as sort of a safe haven for former gang members or gang members trying to get out of that life
ReplyDeletei'm not reading true note books, but i feel that people that are incarecerated isn't always their fault. some people get accused for crimes they didnt do. like the boxer Rubin "Hurricane" Carter, he was falsely accused for 3 murders, and was sentenced to prison. he had severed 20 years in prison, before he was found innocent. so now 20 years of his life is gone for a crime he didnt do. it's been multiple situation were people been sentence to prison for crimes they didnt do, thats why i feel that not every person that is in prison is their fault.
ReplyDeletewhy is it made as an excuse. if its all they know then yes society has a big part on that subject. do u have to deal with drugs, violence, death, and unresponsive and irresponsible parents everyday? NO! then you can not base the fact that the things they dealt with are only an excuse, its who they are
ReplyDeleteI feel that using the phrase "product of enviorment" has really been misused. Just because someone is from the "ghetto" meaning a really urban community with gang violence and such doesn't mean they have to involve themself in it. Growing up without a dad - doesn't mean to fill that gap that you have to join a gang to feel like you are being protected. Those two examples really are commonly associated with the phrase "product of your enviorment".
ReplyDeleteDONT GET ME WRONG! There is situations that may result in being around certain people, but I really am more IF YOU DID SOMETHING WRONG, THERE ISN'T ANY REASON TO DENY IT.
You can't blame being around gang member for 3 years straight a legit reason to shoot an innocent 5 year old girl...
Another fantastic response Sierra! Really good point. The influence of the environment is strong, but ultimately it still is the individual's CHOICE to do the things that place them in prison. They do have to take some degree of responsibility for their actions. Why don't people actually take the influence and the environment as an opportunity to see what NOT to do? Why is this volatile environment apparently so attractive?
ReplyDeleteChristian, how many falsely incarcerated people do you really think there are? And how does that effect what this question is really asking?
I think that they maybe a product of their environment.. but I think that they also make their own decisions. The kids in true notebooks could have easily been like no I don’t want to do that.. but then again I have never been around it to understand it…but in my mind I don’t think that environment had an effect on them.
ReplyDeletedid any of you ever try to think that people are thrown in jail just to meet the quota and get paid. This is the same things police do when they give out tickets.
ReplyDeleteresponding to jeff i feel there a good amount of people falsely incarcerated, not saying that everyone in prison is falsely incarerated. it effects the question because the people that are falsely accused are in jail for something that isnt their fault.
ReplyDelete